Recorded: Welcome to The ReWork with Allison Tyler Jones. A podcast dedicated to inspiring portrait photographers to uniquely brand, profitably price, and confidently sell their best work. Allison has been doing just that for the last 15 years and she’s proven that it’s possible to create unforgettable art and run a portrait business that supports your family and your dreams. All it takes is a little rework. Episodes will include interviews with experts from in and outside of the photo industry, mini-workshops, and behind-the-scenes secrets that Allison uses in her portrait studio every single day. She will challenge your thinking and inspire your confidence to create a profitable, sustainable portrait business you love through continually refining and reworking your business. Let’s do the rework.
Allison Tyler Jones: Hi, friends, and welcome back to The ReWork. Have you fallen out of love with the type of genre that you’re shooting right now, or has there always been a genre that you’ve wanted to dip your toe in, maybe add to your lineup? Well, today’s guest, Kristine Logan, has spent years shooting personal branding, women, and she decided to dip her toe into shooting families, family portraits. And so, we’re going to talk today about how that shift, what was hard about it, what was scary about it, and how she’s been able to navigate that shift. So this could apply regardless of what it is that you’re wanting to add to your portrait studio. If you’re wanting to shift or change genres, this is going to be a good listen for you. So let’s do it. Okay. Well, I am so excited to welcome Kristine Logan to The ReWork podcast studio. Hi, Kristine. I’m so glad that you’re here today.
Kristine Logan: Hello, Allison. Thank you for having me.
Allison Tyler Jones: Well, Kristine, I just noticed right away she was in our summer course of Art of Selling Art and you just stood out to me from the beginning as smarty pants and knows what you’re doing. And so, Kristine, for our listeners who don’t know you, tell a little bit about your business, where you’re located, what you do. Kind of give us the rundown on Kristine Logan.
Kristine Logan: Sure. I am a portrait photographer here in Fort Wayne, Indiana and I’ve been in business since, I think officially, 2011. But I did not start out to be a portrait photographer in business, I started out to be a mom who loved to take pictures of her children and family, like so many of us. And I just wanted to get really, really good at taking pictures of my family. My mom was a portrait photographer, professional photographer, and my brother is-
Allison Tyler Jones: Really? Interesting.
Kristine Logan: And so, I was never as good as they were. So naturally I thought, “That’s for them and I’m just going to have a lot of fun with a camera.” And I’ve had one in my hand since I got my first Pocket Instamatic 110 when I was 12. And then, my mom had tried to teach me the exposure triangle and such. But I was too young at the time and I wasn’t able to absorb, “Oh, there’s too many buttons and things,” and I couldn’t see an immediate result.
Kristine Logan: So I kind of just said, “Point and shoot is my world.” Until the DSLR market opened up a whole new way of learning for me and I became addicted to the process. But again, I started out taking pictures of my kids and then people started asking me. They liked what they saw of my family and they said, “Can you take senior pictures for my son?” And I was like, “Sure.” But I always started with a business model in mind because I have a degree in business. I have a degree in finance. And so, I was never a shoot and burn photographer. I never went that burnout route, but I did go the route of $330 sales, but they were buying prints. I never had great tutelage, didn’t know how to get it. So it’s like CreativeLive became where I first started and then it just blew up from there.
Allison Tyler Jones: I love that. So now what, are you doing?
Kristine Logan: I probably have about a third of my business is headshots. It’s not that I love them. It’s just that it’s a low hanging fruit and it’s easy to get into the portrait biz from there, because that’s an easy Google search. I also do glamour for women and have that Sue Bryce kind of influence heavily from that. I do personal branding as a spinoff of that. And also, I’ve been really working hard, and which is why I got into the Art of Selling Art, was for your influence for families. They terrified me. I was just sweating bullets over the fact, because I don’t think I had the wherewithal and the knowledge to know how to go about doing them properly and correctly and pricing them. And so, that is, I hate to call it my new love, but I’m working very hard on embracing the genre and trying to make that more of my-
Allison Tyler Jones: Tell me more about that. What was scary to you about families? I know what was scary to me about families, but I’d love to know what your thought is on that.
Kristine Logan: Just overwhelming. The first couple of times I tried it, again, I didn’t have a studio. I was very early in my career. And so, I didn’t know how to structure it for success and how to put it together for a plan and I didn’t want to do digital’s only of course. So like sell prints and then it became small prints and then it was maybe Christmas card families. And I was like, “Is it right? I don’t know how to do this.” Or the kids were misbehaving. Dad didn’t want to be there. Dad wanted to… He was missing a football game and he was angry and I felt like all this hostility was directed at me. And then, mom was crazy and she wanted to have everything perfect. And the old saying, “If mom isn’t happy, she’s not going to buy anything.”
Allison Tyler Jones: Sure.
Kristine Logan: So how do you turn this all around, be in charge, drive the truck down the freeway, and come up with a great sale? I couldn’t figure it out based on my past taking one client at a time.
Allison Tyler Jones: Right. Seemed like a lot. Yeah. But it is a lot. I mean, from even a creative standpoint, posing. It’s a completely different genre, for sure.
Kristine Logan: Yep. So that’s when I heard about you and turned to you and never really finding another real leader in the industry who was doing what I wanted to do as well as I wanted to do it. And actually, if you remember Sandra Shinkfield from the Art of Selling Art, she had done it first and we had been in an accountability group together. And she kept talking about, “ATJ this,” and so I started following you and said, “Okay. I get it. This-”
Allison Tyler Jones: How funny.
Kristine Logan: … “This is the fountain of information that I need to know to-”
Allison Tyler Jones: Fountain of something.
Kristine Logan: Well, experience. Experience. Yeah.
Allison Tyler Jones: So you took Art of Selling Art in 2022, summer of 2022. And so, what has been the benefit of that? What resonated with you specifically? What do you feel like you were able to take away and implement?
Kristine Logan: Well, the first thing that I fixed, I remember you used the words somewhere north of 3,000. And just when we structure those early consultations and things like that, to really set up the sale. And I had been doing it, but I wasn’t doing it well. And I wasn’t doing it as precisely as I think I’m trying to do now and I think that’s changed my success. Because I never was shoot and burn, pricing was always kind of there, but I was stalling out. I first stalled out at about $2,800. I thought, “Ah, I know I can do better than that.” And then, I realized the words I was using in the consultation, I was giving them the low side of it. I would say, “You could spend anywhere from,” and I love the alliteration, “1,500 to 15,000.” And so, guess how many people would go, “Oh, 1,500 sounds good to me,” in their-
Allison Tyler Jones: Exactly. Sure.
Kristine Logan: And then, it was getting these people who wanted my lowest package at 1,500. I’m like, “No, I don’t want you here. I don’t want anybody buying this package.” So that was the start of when I heard you say, “Some place north of 3,000,” I said, “This is how I have to change it. I have to change their expectations. I have to change and manage the way I communicate.” And I still work on that all the time, because I’m not as confident as I want to be and I’m getting there. Because I still stall out a little bit. Now, my sales average is about 6,000 and I’m stalling out again-
Allison Tyler Jones: Awesome.
Kristine Logan: And so, I know I’ve got to go back and change the way I prepare them and that starts with the words I use and the confidence I bring to that conversation.
Allison Tyler Jones: I think that’s such a good point. And to give credit where credit is due, I used to say clients spend anywhere from 5,000 to 50,000 or whatever. And it was Kimberly Wiley that told me, she goes, “Don’t put people in a box. Let them say north of. And so, then that way…” Because say if you… For your example, what were you saying, 3,000 to 30,000?
Kristine Logan: 1,500 to 15,000.
Allison Tyler Jones: 1,500 to 15,000. Okay. So in that scenario, if a client is spending $8,000, they feel like they have just blown… They’re way crazy. Or maybe they really want some big, large scale wall art and they need it and they’re going about 15 to 20,000. Then they’re like, “Oh, this is the most she’s ever had anybody ever spend with her.” It’s just not a good… You don’t need to put a cap on it and just north of just kind of leaves it. It gives you an idea of what the minimum would be. But that lets you know that most people are spending more than that.
Kristine Logan: Exactly. And if they want more information after that, they will ask. And my problem was I wasn’t comfortable inviting those conversations. I kind of skimmed over it because I was uncomfortable with it for whatever reason. And so then, it became a matter of me just shooting on spec more, right? After pinning them down on what they want, I’m not asking them for details about wall art. I’m not leading the process. I’m waiting for them to choose and to react. And then, you’re shooting and they’re ditching all of these. I was waiting for them to come back and say, “Hey, this is what I want.” And then, I was sad when I… As you would say, a piece of your artistic soul is thrown into the trash can and there’s nothing you can do about it at-
Allison Tyler Jones: Right. At that point. Yeah, because you haven’t prepared them. Yeah. For sure.
Kristine Logan: Yeah. It’s over. So I think that was the big thing. But what also happened to me was, why I came back for the alumni, was I hadn’t implemented everything the first time. I always think, “Well, why? Am I not a good student?” And I think sometimes in this process, in this journey, you’re only ready for so much at a time.
Allison Tyler Jones: Absolutely.
Kristine Logan: And I felt… Also, I have a horrible FOMO case where I’m always feeling like I was missing out. And I remember struggling about, “Should I join the MindShift membership or not?” And the first time around, I knew I wasn’t ready. There was just so much I needed to absorb and fight within my own lack of systems and-
Allison Tyler Jones: Sure.
Kristine Logan: … some craziness I had. And so, when it opened up again, I said, “No, I am here. I think I get it, all of it. I have to now implement it.” And so, once I went through it again, it just became, I’m not going to call it old hat. But it was such a delightful refresher to say, “Oh, I forgot about this and I forgot about that.” Even though I had made notes and stuff, but it forced me to go back and look at it all again with a new lens. And I think that was a pivotal mountain top-
Allison Tyler Jones: Right.
Kristine Logan: … moment where you go, “Oh. We’re going to be good.” And so, now forcing myself to take time out and really sit and go and implement where all those weaknesses lie. I just want to be more efficient and to be better at what I do. So I can spend more time with my family as opposed to working six or seven days a week and that’s the recipe for burnout disaster, resentment-
Allison Tyler Jones: For sure. Well, and I think you make a good point too, that when you’re learning something or you’re making changes in your business, we want it to be overnight. We want it to be immediate. And it just can’t be because you implement something and then you get information back from that. Your business is going to be different than mine. You have a different clientele than I do. We might have similar clientele, so we might be offering similar products and a similar process. But even still, there’s so much nuance to each one of those interactions even.
Allison Tyler Jones: And your personality is different than mine, right? And so, how you like to sell and how you like to live and how you would like to run your business is going to be different. So there’s going to be things that will come up where you’re like, “Oh, I really don’t like that and I need to adjust this so that it works for Kristine Logan. This might be great for ATJ, but it’s not really working great for me. So how do I then adjust that?”
Allison Tyler Jones: And that doesn’t happen overnight, and it doesn’t happen implementing seven things at a time. It happens implementing one thing at a time. And then, paying really close attention and iterating thereafter. And so, I think the way you did it is smart. You take the course, you implement what you can, and then you come back. And maybe do it as alumni and then the MindShift membership. And we love having you. I love having you in there. So it’s just fun for me to see because I think you are primed. Like the fact that you started from the beginning as the, “I want to have this as a business,” and then… But I got to know more about your mom. So she is a portrait photographer?
Kristine Logan: Well, she’s passed. But in her prime, she… She didn’t get married until she was in her early 30s. And so for a woman at her age at that time, that was rare.
Allison Tyler Jones: Sure.
Kristine Logan: I think all her friends had been married for 15 years by the time she got married. And she loved… She was somewhat of a hobbyist, but she also worked for a portrait photographer in a portrait studio. She did retouching. She shot a few weddings and things like that. But we really have some of the most beautiful portrait photography as children because our mom, that was something she loved to do. And she would take the old black and white negatives and hand paint them, colorize them and we have a lot of those. And they’re absolutely extraordinary. I mean, they’re like little mini paintings. So she was a bit of a painter and an artist, a musician, and a photographer. And so, growing up, as we did more in the ’70s and the late ’60s, it was still very much in vogue for her to stay home with us. But she still did a lot of these things on the side. Little hustles, if you will.
Allison Tyler Jones: Sure.
Kristine Logan: And she taught music lessons and things like that. But photography, she always had a camera in her hand. It’s-
Allison Tyler Jones: I love that.
Kristine Logan: … like that was a very natural thing for me to see growing up. That that’s just what you did as a mom is you were constantly taking these pictures. But it wasn’t the mass production that we see now. It was very intentional and she would have one or two really classically beautiful things of each of us instead of having the 18 million cellphone pictures that people see now. That’s-
Allison Tyler Jones: Right. Well, and what a foundation and a tapestry or a thread, if you will, if want to mix your metaphors for your brand. To be able to speak to that as a mother yourself, but then also having a mother that in the time pre-digital, that everything… It was special. It wasn’t 9 million pictures. It was like a concept. You fulfilled the concept and you executed it to the highest value, the highest artistic quality. And so, that is such a… Like if I was going to come sell your work, I would sit you down and spend another hour with you and just like, “Okay. Give me all the details on your mom. Tell me about your brother. Tell me about…” That would… “We are a family of photographers. This is in our DNA and we do it differently because I was raised this way.” And so, whether she ever meant that to be priming you as a business or a salesperson is irrelevant. It’s the core to who you are and I think that’s really cool.
Kristine Logan: Well, and one of the best lessons I had in why we do what we do… I mean, there’s a lot of good ones, is my mom got early onset Alzheimer’s. And so, you forget things in reverse order that you’ve learned them. So her past was more vibrant than her present. And there was a point in time where I remember we were taking her into the nursing home. And my dad had taken care of her for about 10 years and it was just getting to be too much. She was too advanced. She was having challenges.
Kristine Logan: And so, we were packing up things to take to her room and trying to, again, go from the past. And so, at this time, I was in my 40s and she packed up my senior portrait. That’s who she knew me as the 18-year-old girl in her senior pictures. Not the woman who was her daughter and the mother to her grandchildren. And I actually showed it to her. And she was nonverbal almost immediately, because that was the center of her brain that was attacked first. And I showed it to her and she couldn’t call me by name. She couldn’t. She hadn’t said my name for years. But I showed her that picture and I asked her, I said, “Do you know who that is?” And she did and I thought… Oh my gosh. I’m getting verklempt. But that is the power of why we print, that is the power of why we landmark those very, very special moments in a child’s life. Because for her, she didn’t forget any of those. But yet, the present for her was gone. But that picture, she knew that was me.
Allison Tyler Jones: Yeah.
Kristine Logan: It was amazing.
Allison Tyler Jones: Oh, I love that. That’s an amazing story. Thank you for sharing that. I love that. Yeah. It really is so, so, so amazing why we do that. I love that history for you. And I think if you haven’t leaned into that, I think you could… There’s so many depths there for you. Marketing-wise, words as you’re advising clients. Expertise-wise, when you have young mothers in there that are wondering about what to do and, “Should I do this? And shouldn’t I do that?” I mean, wow. You have a wealth of information there. I think that’s so amazing. One of the things that we sent to you before we recorded this, I just wanted to ask you a couple of these questions. So hopefully, you got them.
Kristine Logan: Sure.
Allison Tyler Jones: So let me just run through those and ask you these questions and then see what you come up with. If you had a genie that would grant you one wish for your business now, what would it be?
Kristine Logan: To have a perfectly well-tuned CRM that does everything magically as it should.
Allison Tyler Jones: Oh, I know. If only, right?
Kristine Logan: If only. Yeah.
Allison Tyler Jones: If only. I know. And I think we all wish that and I don’t know that it’s ever going to happen. But what do you think you could do or what have you done that’s helped you address the problems that a lack of that is presenting for you?
Kristine Logan: Well, you had really good words a while back in one of our classes when you had talked about, “Get one and stick with it.” Well, I have not done that unfortunately. The one I have now was gifted to me for the first year, because I won a one-year subscription. So I said, “Okay. We’ll run with it,” and I’m kept with it. But it’s very buggy, it has a lot of challenges, and it just sometimes just doesn’t process. It doesn’t go through the wheel spins and I’ll call and  say, “Oh, we don’t know why you seem to have problems,” that’s that kind of thing.
Kristine Logan: So I have set aside, in January, the second week or right after New Year’s when I normally would go to imaging or normally go to a conference or to do something special educational. To just block that out and to make a decision. I have two that I’m in tests for. One has been paid for, for the full year, and I haven’t even started it, but it’s quite expensive. And I have a new one, which a friend had recommended and I got in on the ground floor, so it’s very inexpensive. So I’m going to choose that week and I’m going to just dedicate time to transferring it over and getting it-
Allison Tyler Jones: So smart.
Kristine Logan: … at least done. Just focus on that. Instead of getting more advanced education, I said, “I’ve got to implement before I can move forward.” And so, that’s my goal. It’s just-
Allison Tyler Jones: Right. Well, because that’s such a core. Your database is what you’re working off of. You’ve got to have that dialed-
Kristine Logan: Yeah. And I think I can streamline it financially to benefit me as well. Because some of these newer things are so encompassing, you can start getting rid of all of these other site subscriptions. So that’s my plan is just to start with the financial efficiency as well as then the whole data efficiency.
Allison Tyler Jones: Good. Well, when you get that all figured out and it’s amazing, then we’re going to have you come back and tell us what you did.
Kristine Logan: Tell you what I did. Okay.
Allison Tyler Jones: I think, Kristine, something that’s so genius about that goal is that, like you said, instead of just inputting more things, I’m actually going to execute on something that has been on my list for a very, very long time. I love that.
Kristine Logan: Mm-hmm. Yeah.
Allison Tyler Jones: Another question we had is what is something that you learned in Art of Selling Art or in the MindShift community that has led to a positive change in your business?
Kristine Logan: I think the whole concept of not shooting on spec is another major mind shift for me. Because I think I have spent the bulk of my career, and I can hear an early influence saying, “Oh, the more they cry, the more they buy,” and so… And I do. I get that. I feel like I’ve always had an artist’s eye, but the rest of the business isn’t as intuitive, even though I have a degree in business. I find that to be very amusing. Yes, it’s incredibly helpful for a lot of things. But specific to photography, it’s still a learned skill.
Allison Tyler Jones: Sure.
Kristine Logan: And I think learning what works by sometimes what doesn’t work takes a long time. So having these resources now that you provide from a wealth of experience that says, “This is how to do it,” makes so much sense. And so, giving up that mass presentation and I’m getting better at it. With high school seniors, I do find the more I show, the more they do buy. That I tone it down too much. But there’s now the focus of not having 60 images in an album, but trying to get them to put more on the wall and focusing on that and helping them focus on bigger things. Because I know how… And this sounds terrible, I know how to manipulate for money. I’m a good salesperson. I can make them and encourage those big buys. I have no problem doing that, but I don’t know if that serves them best.
Allison Tyler Jones: And that is such a good point because I think there are probably people listening to this that are good at sales. I feel like I’m in the same boat, but I realized I don’t want somebody to leave me and shake their head and be like, Ooh, did I just have the Men in Black little wand?” Like, “Oh, was I just bamboozled? And actually, I really didn’t want that.” I think the best sales is transparency and really helping people to get what they really want.
Kristine Logan: Really want. Yeah.
Allison Tyler Jones: What they really want.
Kristine Logan: Yes. And having them focus on fewer things. I’ve always been wall art, albums, and then folios for the smaller end, because I make them buy in at 20 before I’ll even do an album for them. I’m not sure I’m going to continue with that. But I think pushing them more into wall art and getting something beautiful up on the wall, it’s such a foreign concept for many of our clients who come with this shoot and burn past perhaps. But I think it makes so much sense. And again, I go back to that story with my mom. I mean, she wasn’t looking at a flash drive full of 250 shoot and burn shots or something like that and she… I didn’t even get an album. We had six in a collage and the one… She focused on exactly what she wanted.
Allison Tyler Jones: Yep. And that one iconic image that she’d walked by for years and years and years in her house and that was burned into her brain.
Kristine Logan: Burned into her brain and that, I think, is the gift. And then, making sure that it’s beautifully done, it’s beautifully framed. It is a piece of art that happens to be your family, as you would say. It’s those important things that really teach… We need to teach them how to appreciate themselves as art. And if we’re mass-producing as many images as we can, because we feel like… I mean, we all see these groups and clubs and they’re bragging about how much money they’re making.
Kristine Logan: “Oh, I had $100,000 month. I just had a $500,000 quarter. I just had a $32,000 sale.” I hear it all the time and it’s the coulda, woulda, should have. And I have to block all of that noise out for me and say, “Okay. That’s great. Somebody’s figured out a whole lot of stuff that maybe I don’t know and I may never know. But if I just focus on serving my client, and it’s always…” This may sound corny, but when I go into a sales session, I always pray. And I think, “It is payday today. And if I shut my mouth and get out of my way, the sky’s the limit.” It’s more of the prayer that I serve them-
Allison Tyler Jones: For sure.
Kristine Logan: … myself. Because if I’m just going to think about… I have one influence that would say, “Yeah. You can size up and think what you’re going to get out of that sale.” Yeah. That’s true. I think, “Well, they’ve talked about the album, but I’m not sure about wall art. They’re still iffy.” But I really think if my true intention is serving them for what they value, what they need, what they will love. And it’s not about in the back of my mind, “Oh, could be a $20,000 sale,” or, “If I close this, it’s going to be a blowout quarter.” I can’t do that. I was from that business environment. I was in banking where every quarter had to-
Allison Tyler Jones: Oh, yeah.
Kristine Logan: … than the last quarter. And at some point, and maybe it’s me limiting myself, I don’t feel comfortable operating that way and that I truly appreciate whatever their sale is. I don’t like it when it’s low. Obviously, none of us like to be on the low end of it. But if I know that they got everything they needed and wanted, and maybe I am still at the very, very tip-top outer reaches of their budget, and they save for that, and they wanted a Kristine Logan for X amount, I have to be okay with that and say, “I’ve served them as well as I can.” Regardless what that price point is. And I think learning to embrace that more has helped me just get out of my own way and stop thinking about what those numbers say and mean. Because in the end, it does… Money doesn’t mean that much to me, I guess. Maybe that’s-
Allison Tyler Jones: Yeah. Well, I don’t think it has to be. Either you’re in it only for the money or you’re a kind and good, gracious person. I think that both of those things can exist because the reality is that money is the life blood that feeds our business. That’s how we stay in business. That’s how we’re profitable. And that’s how we’re able to do what we do for clients over a period of time and provide images that their moms can remember when they are having Alzheimer’s. Or when that senior girl is no longer here, your daughter and your granddaughter are going to be picking up that image.
Allison Tyler Jones: So for me, I agree with you. I don’t go into a sale thinking, “Okay. I’m going to knock it out of the park. I’m going to make it this.” But I do have the idea of in that consultation, so before we ever even get to shooting, is making sure that I’m aligned with that client. That they understand how we work and that we both want the same thing. That we both are working toward a finished product and that they know exactly how much that’s going to be.
Allison Tyler Jones: And because the transparency is upfront, then we don’t have the fear of the bait and switch. And so then, the money part gets taken care of before the shoot happens. So like you said, then we aren’t shooting on spec. I don’t have any of those feelings like I’m doing a bait and switch or that I’m hoping that they spend money, because I pretty much know what it will be, right?
Allison Tyler Jones: Now, they might do a little bit more, they might do a little bit less, depending on what the circumstances are. But then, I know that I’ve done the job and I know that if somebody comes in and they really are… Like they just can’t. They’re like, “I just can’t spend that much money on portraits,” that’s okay. Come back when you can because that’s just how we work. And it doesn’t mean that you’re less worthy. It doesn’t mean we hate you. It doesn’t mean that you’re not our client. It just means that you’re not our client right now.
Kristine Logan: Yes.
Allison Tyler Jones: So I think that both of those things can exist. I want to be profitable. I want to be sustainable because I want to be able to create these, like you say, pieces of my soul for clients until I can’t do it any longer. But the only way I can do that is if I’m making enough money to be able to do it and people support it-
Kristine Logan: Exactly. And I don’t mean to say that. I don’t think we should have those goals. I’m just saying I can’t make that my motivation anymore. Because it used to be and I found that I got too caught up in, “Well, how many images did I sell?” I mean, sure. It’s exciting. We all like to go, “Oh, I had a really big sale.” And I don’t plaster that out there in those groups unless someone asks me a specific question about, “Well, what can you do for a senior? I can’t get my families to buy more than $800.” I’m like, “Oh, I had a $10,000 senior sale in November.” So yes, you can.
Kristine Logan: But it’s different for me. I think I had that switch. And I love the word that you used was transparency. And that’s something that I have picked up from you and from your course is that consultation… I never used to do this. I would plant the bread trail like Hansel and Gretel and lead them to the end. And I thought, “Gosh. I’m the wicked witch here at the end.” Because then, “Oh, look at all the images. I sold them.” I really do like to use that word transparency now and say, “Let’s talk about what you want to do with them. Where will these portraits live?” I did it. I did lose track of a family session the other day and I thought, “Oh, Allison would be so disappointed in me.” Where they asked for a second clothing change, but they were African and they wanted English clothing and they wanted one traditional tribal look.
Allison Tyler Jones: Oh, I love that.
Kristine Logan: And I said, “Sure.” And then, the tribal, which was just going to be family, turned into everybody and every combination. Dad started bringing them in and he was a doctor and he was very-
Allison Tyler Jones: Forceful.
Kristine Logan: Yeah. In charge. And how do you say no? And then I thought, “Oh my gosh, I’m losing track. Did I get everybody? Did I get all the combinations?” Your system really does make sense for keeping things nice and neatly packaged and repeatable and profitable. And it also keeps your sanity in check because-
Allison Tyler Jones: Debatable.
Kristine Logan: Well, no, but it really works. Yeah. It really is a formula for success. And so, I am really appreciative of learning those things. And transparency, again, I think is another big one. Because I hear myself using it and telling them, “I want to be perfectly transparent with you about price,” which is something I never did before and I think it-
Allison Tyler Jones: I think people appreciate that so much.
Kristine Logan: They do. And they tell you that, “Thank you so much. I really appreciate that.” Because I always say, “I want to make sure you are adequately budgeted, so there aren’t any surprises.” And as you say, it still can go up or down a little bit. Nothing wrong with that. They understand. We all do that. We go out to dinner or we go on a shopping spree. We all do that. But it’s not as big of a shop or a shock if they say, “I really need to go for that first package you’ve got at 10.” And then, next thing you know, they’re buying 63 and it’s five times the price and they’re not happy. And that-
Allison Tyler Jones: They aren’t prepared.
Kristine Logan: And they don’t come back and I think I’ve done that too. I’ve seen clients come and spend more than they wanted. And then, I see them go somewhere else and I have to ask myself, “Why?” And I know why. I can’t point my finger at anybody else. It’s me.
Allison Tyler Jones: I love that.
Kristine Logan: So I think that makes a difference between how they feel at the end of the day. Even though they don’t call you back and say, “Oh, I have regret,” or… No, they just don’t come back and that doesn’t lead for successful studio.
Allison Tyler Jones: Yeah. And back in the day when we wasn’t doing consultations quite to how I do them now, we would have that happen where somebody would get carried away and spend a lot. And then, we would call them and say, “Okay. Did you want to book for this next year?” And they’d say, “I just can’t spend $15,000 every year,” whatever the amount was. And you would say, “Well, of course, we wouldn’t expect you to do that.” But then, in their mind it was because we didn’t have the consultation of like, “You might spend this. You might spend this. Here’s the different ways that we can do it.” So I feel like having that transparency ahead of time just helps them to know that this year is probably going to be a pretty big year, because it’s the first time we’ve worked together. Next year might be a little bit less. It just depends on what you’re doing. But they have an idea that they can expand and contract. They can figure that out themselves.
Kristine Logan: Yeah. And they can take themselves out gracefully without feeling guilt and shame about, “Oh, I can never talk to Allison again,” or-
Allison Tyler Jones: Right. Because she so magicked me and ozzed me that I know that if I go in there, she’s going to make me spend them all.
Kristine Logan: That’s right. She’s going to trap me with all her beautiful things in her studio and her beautiful artwork. And what we really want is every client’s going to be different that way and we have to make sure we meet them where they’re at instead of where we want them to be. That’s not necessarily the same thing.
Allison Tyler Jones: Yeah. It’s a little bit about where they’re at, what they think they want, but really showing them, getting at the root of what they really, really want. And showing them the possibilities like, “This is what could be.” And then, them realizing, “Actually, you know what? I don’t want to spend 10,000 for a senior, but I would spend 10,000 for my family. So let’s do a $5,000 senior session. What does that look like? And then let me book in for my family and…” You know what I mean? It’s allowing them to make the choice. So I love hearing about that journey and I love that you’ve spent this time with me. It’s so valuable for our listeners to hear. Where can our listeners find you, like social media, website? We’re going to link these on the show notes. But where can we find you on Instagram?
Kristine Logan: So Instagram and Facebook is Kristine Logan Photography and I have two websites which I’m trying to merge into one eventually. But my general site is kristinelogan.com, Kristine with a K. And then, for my families and my black label which is under kristineloganportrait.com. So sometimes I send people just specially that way and I send all my families that way.
Allison Tyler Jones: Okay. But we’ll link to all of it in the show notes so that people can find you where you’re at.
Kristine Logan: Great.
Allison Tyler Jones: Anything else you have? Any parting advice you want to give to any struggling photographers out there?
Kristine Logan: The best advice I wish I would’ve given myself was to deal with my FOMO. And I feel like I was constantly… I think I was just so hungry. I was like a sponge. I was soaking everything up, but I didn’t soak it up as completely as I should have. And I really wish I would’ve taken more time that after I’ve learned something, to make sure it was fully implemented to the best of my capability before I searched out anything new. Whether that’s technology or business or editing or whatever it is, like CRM.
Allison Tyler Jones: Yeah. For sure.
Kristine Logan: I might not be here years later still struggling with a stupid CRM, but I think that’s true. But I also was given the advice early on from a local business coach I worked with through our… We have something called the Women’s Economic Opportunity Center, which supports small women businesses. And one of the mentors there told me, she goes, “Oh, you’re so good. You’re putting all these PDFs together and visuals and blah, blah, blah.” She goes, “You need to make money. You need to focus on the money. You need to really, really, really focus on the money.”
Kristine Logan: And so, I now have almost reversed that and focused too much on the money and not brought the business along with me to keep it efficient and smooth. So you got to find that balance between focusing on the income, which of course, as you said, we all are in it to pay our bills and to have a wonderful life that we’re choosing to create for our families. But managing that, still bringing along those other aspects of technology, marketing with you at the same time.
Kristine Logan: You can’t be so solely focused on one or the other. You have to find that balance. But to manage that FOMO so that when you are taking in new information, you’re exploiting it fully before you search out another class or another set of presets or don’t let the Black Friday get in your way. And I think I’ve wasted a lot of time, maybe some money too. I think I’ve been pretty careful with the money. But I think I’ve wasted a lot of time chasing things that I didn’t fully embrace and really get to know it and implement it. And hey, this is how we learn.
Allison Tyler Jones: Totally. And sometimes I feel like people are education junkies or whatever you like… I would consider myself an education junkie. I love to learn. I love to learn new things. But sometimes you buy something or you take something and maybe the reason that you haven’t implemented is that it just didn’t quite vibe with you. And so, in that regard, if it isn’t, then it’s probably good that you didn’t. And then, go on to where something really does resonate that you’re able to implement and move forward in a way that’s really true for you. So I just love to see you soar. I love watching your progress and that you’re a valued member of our group and I just so appreciate you taking the time to be with us today.
Kristine Logan: Well, thank you. As I’ve said, you are kind of like Prego or that commercial for the pasta sauce. It’s all in there. And I think what you have done so much better than so many out there who educate photographers is show us your wealth of experience, but you really show us sensible steps and ways to look at things. And again, having a business background, I can tell you how much good business is in there. I mean, you can-
Allison Tyler Jones: Thank you.
Kristine Logan: …be a part of somebody’s program. Understanding your numbers and cost of doing business and things like that. It’s just so, so important to building that foundation. And so, I just have, like I said, I have the highest regard for you and what you do. And you’re always so kind and you make yourself so available to your students. It’s just a real gift and that’s only going to raise the standard for the industry. So that we all can be successful.
Allison Tyler Jones: Absolutely. That’s the goal, is we just want as many people to be… Because it’s so important what we do and it’s so valuable what we do.
Kristine Logan: Yeah. We are entrusted with the legacies.
Allison Tyler Jones: Absolutely.
Kristine Logan: Ultimately, other people will hand it down, but we made it happen, and that’s just amazing. Really, it’s a gift.
Allison Tyler Jones: It is. Well, you’re a gift to our group and I appreciate you so much. Thank you for being here today.
Kristine Logan: Thank you for having me.
Recorded: You can find more great resources from Allison at dotherework.com and on Instagram, @do.the.rework.
